Switching Projects - Do I Dump The Miata!?

"whatuptkhere" (whatuptkhere) 07/11/2017 at 22:38 • Filed to: supra, toyota, toyota supra, mx-5, mazda mx-5, miata

2

50

Note: Author is in Australia, where prices for everything are wildly different and we call Miatas MX-5s.

It’s a tough time. I’m starting to get my MX-5 project to the point where it’s a little tastier. I’ve thrown in a bigger radiator, Torsen LSD, and brakes from the later 1.8 model. But I’m at a crossroads.

Currently I’m contemplating dropping money on a Megasquirt ECU as the first step down the road of turbocharging the car. It’s not a cheap process, costing several thousand dollars to do it the “right” way. I’m certainly not interested in any nasty eBay kits or doing it on a crazy budget by using hacky methods like rising rate fuel pressure regulators and timing boxes.

But here’s the thing. I spent $4000 on my MX-5, plus $1000 on a diff upgrade, let alone the other parts, and now I’m looking at a bill of around $5000 easily to fit a turbo for around 200 hp at the wheels.

Here’s the problem though - if I want more, I’ve got to make wild changes. You can build the 1.6 L motor, but then you might as well swap to a 1.8 L instead. But then you need a whole new set of turbo manifolds. That might get you to 350, even 400hp. But if you then want to go further, you then need to go to a turbo K20 swap. Huge expense, new turbo manifolds, new subframe, new gearbox, new differential... It’s a big deal every step up you want to take.

At that point I think - wait, why am I not building a Supra instead?

Now that may sound crazy at the outset, but figure this. If I can score a decent manual, NA Supra for under $8000, I can fit a turbo kit for roughly the same price as I can on the MX-5, but I would instead have 3 litres of turbo six power. The five speeds are reportedly good to 350-400 hp, and even after that, all that’s required is a gearbox and diff change to go all the way up to 600hp. What’s more, coilovers cost the same whether you’re building a Supra or an MX-5, and I suspect the Supra doesn’t feel as cheap inside as the Mazda does.

The thing that’s holding me back, however, is parts. The MX-5 is hugely popular and I have a lot of knowledge on it. I know I can get a 5-speed for $200, a 6 speed for $1000, and I’m well versed in all the rear-end and engine options too.

The Supra is a bit more shadowy to me - for example, if I buy an NA Supra, will I end up having to spend $5000 to swap out half the drivetrain just to get an LSD? Is there something I don’t know about turboing NAs that is a huge pitfall and makes it more trouble than spending $25000 on a good TT?

What I’m asking for is any tips, pointers, or advice on my plan. Am I crazy thinking I can build a sweet, powerful Supra for street and track for not much more than an MX-5?

Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 22:47

0

What’s the pricing like for Corvettes there? You pay $10 per HP here for one in passable shape.

Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/11/2017 at 22:51

0

Don’t even think they sold vettes in au

daender > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 22:51

0

Quick question: do you have any track day experience or will it be your first time?

The reason I ask is that it’s a lot less expensive to crash, damage, or grenade a Miata than a MK IV Supra.

Follow-up question: Have you ridden in a Supra during a track day? The reason I ask is that a MK IV Supra is going to be fair bit heavier so it may not be as responsive or chuck-into-a-corner-friendly as a Miata.

Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief > Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner 07/11/2017 at 22:55

1

That was my actual question. I have no idea if they have Corvettes esp older ones. I was trying to wrap a passive aggressive comment in about how America is better because the original poster is Australian and I have enough Australian friends to know they generally like a good shit talk.

Flex my boost > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 22:57

0

Their suppose to be call MX-5 here, but Americans are hard to train. We’re Just plain stubborn.

punkgoose17 > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 23:00

0

I am a fan of the MK II Supra design, so without any knowledge or insite I say build a MK II.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/11/2017 at 23:07

0

And then beat the snot out of them. When are the brake parts due?

Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/11/2017 at 23:07

0

Oh I’m so dumb rn

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/11/2017 at 23:08

0

Has Dude in Oregon reassembled the Carrera 4 yet?

Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/11/2017 at 23:09

0

Merica

Nauraushaun > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 23:18

1

Finding a decent Supra on the market, there’s your problem

whatuptkhere > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/11/2017 at 23:19

0

$40000 for a clean C4; probably $100,000 for a C6.

We drive on the opposite side here which is a big part of it, so they’re custom converted and imported.

whatuptkhere > daender 07/11/2017 at 23:21

1

I’ve been out to the track once; funnily enough I spun and it was quite terrifying.

That is actually something worth considering. If I build a turbo Miata and crash, I can pick up another shell for a few K. Not so easy with a Supra which are much thinner on the ground.

whatuptkhere > Nauraushaun 07/11/2017 at 23:22

0

Yeah, true. The biggest thing for me is, if I can find a manual NA, am I going to be able to get a decent LSD into it without searching for a year first?

2Fast2Furious: Rotary Powered > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 23:47

0

I look at it like this (an American) the miata, even with it’s wet paper chassis is still the more track oriented of the two. With the Supra you gonna be building a reliable street car and since it’s a 2j you could even dd it

AestheticsInMotion > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 23:51

0

As a Miata owner and lover—go for the Supra. Hands down

DutchieDC2R > whatuptkhere 07/11/2017 at 23:52

0

I dont know much about the pricing in Au, but turning the N/A Supra into a single turbo beast is not easy or cheap.

http://www.suprastore.com/ihatmynonsup.html

There are numerous threads on this subject online. The people down here saying ‘if youre thinking of going mx5 above Supra youre this/that’ are completely uninformed. I love the MK4, it is one of my favourite cars, but the N/A is a hard to tune car and will eat your wallet.

I had a MX-5 NB, 1.8 with an aftermarket turbo, it was a lovely car. Not comparable to a Supra, but honestly, the N/A (Ive driven a friends) MK4 feels heavy, sluggish and, may I say, underpowered.

Maybe find a middle road here.....R32/R33 GTS-T or something....?

Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/12/2017 at 00:18

0

A week. I forgot there’s a couple bolts that can’t be reused so I’m the delay.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner 07/12/2017 at 00:20

0

Can’t you spell? It’s Murica.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief 07/12/2017 at 00:21

0

Like, caliper bolts? It wouldn’t surprise me any, but I’ve never seen it.

I think a WylWood conversion would be fun. Whatever that ratio was between the cost of the brakes and the cost of the car just tells me that you got a bargain on the car.

Flynorcal: pilot, offshore sailor, car racer and panty thief > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/12/2017 at 00:33

1

Caliper bolts. Exactly. Shop manual arrived today and says to replace them as they self lock. I would have reused the old bolts but I’d feel fucking dumb if I bought directions, read them, didn’t follow them and shit broke.

AfromanGTO > whatuptkhere 07/12/2017 at 00:47

0

Why no ute? You’re an Aussie. Plus you have to have stuff “engineered”, so why not go with something that has power to begin with?

MonkeePuzzle > whatuptkhere 07/12/2017 at 01:02

0

when i was on schoolies up the coast two decades ago I saw a supra, and the vision is as clear to me today as it was then. I habe never thoight thr same about an mx5. the mx5 is great, but if there is a chance you could build a supra for similar money I’d go for it.

plus, hardtop vs convetible. when building some power I know which I’d prefer.

whatuptkhere > DutchieDC2R 07/12/2017 at 02:10

0

Yeah.

The other thing I’m hearing a lot is that the Supra isn’t actually the best choice for a track car, being a heavier beast.

I’m thinking that since I’m:
A: a complete novice when it comes to track driving and more likely to crash

B: not going drag racing
C: keen on keeping things to a relatively reasonable budget

I’ll continue with the turbo MX-5 build.

I just can’t see myself needing 400+HP at this stage of my driving career anyway. I think I’ve got a lot of learning to do first.

pip bip - choose Corrour > whatuptkhere 07/12/2017 at 05:13

0

Motec?

Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/12/2017 at 07:30

0

Yes I can spell. I’m just lazy so I wrote America and took off the a. All on my phone which has automatic suggestion s

nerd_racing > whatuptkhere 07/12/2017 at 07:36

0

I know a guy out of Florida that pushes 600-700 HP out of 1.8L Miata engines. There is room to make great power. I don’t think there is anywhere enough traction at that power though.

nerd_racing > whatuptkhere 07/12/2017 at 07:37

0

What about going to an RX7 or an RX8?

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner 07/12/2017 at 08:57

0

I hope my remark came off as a joke...

awmaster10 > whatuptkhere 07/12/2017 at 09:57

0

Damn at $6000-8000 for a nice LT1 manual C4 its a great performance bargain in your price range. Shame its completely different pricing there but you guys have all the cool japanese sports cars we never got so it works out fine.

awmaster10 > DutchieDC2R 07/12/2017 at 10:00

0

Wow r32 Gts-T for sure would be my choice in this situation. Already turboed so you save thousands, great clean lines, and if you get tired of it you can export it to america for like $384092340938

Mini Guy- Now has a 4Runner > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 07/12/2017 at 12:00

1

It did. Don’t worry

whatuptkhere > awmaster10 07/13/2017 at 21:31

1

Yeah, I reckon a C4 would be great, but yeah here they’re all well over $30,000.

whatuptkhere > nerd_racing 07/13/2017 at 21:34

0

I thought about doing one, but to be honest, I want something reliable that isn’t going to need constant rebuilds. That, and as I’m teaching myself tuning along the way, piston engines just seem much more accessible.

whatuptkhere > pip bip - choose Corrour 07/13/2017 at 21:34

0

Nah, going Megasquid.

whatuptkhere > nerd_racing 07/13/2017 at 21:35

0

Oh really, who’s that?

I think I’m gonna stick with the MX-5 after all. Parts are just so cheap (which is important when you’re breaking things on track) and since I fixed the O2 sensor it’s running way better now.

whatuptkhere > AfromanGTO 07/13/2017 at 21:36

0

I really am not even slightly into utes unfortunately, and all the Aussie V8 cars are:
A: very very heavy

B: in no way really set up to handle unless you’re spending megabucks on the latest and greatest Clubsports/HSVs

We have big V8 power, but we don’t have it available in a lightweight sportscar chassis like the Americans do with the Corvette. We’ve only got it in land barges.

whatuptkhere > awmaster10 07/13/2017 at 21:37

1

I’m thinking I’ll keep the MX-5 and when I get a bit older/have more cash, I’ll buy a GTR.

pip bip - choose Corrour > whatuptkhere 07/14/2017 at 00:25

0

Never heard of them

nerd_racing > whatuptkhere 07/14/2017 at 06:57

0

That has honestly been blown way out of proportion. My FB had 170k+ on it with zero rebuilds.

nerd_racing > whatuptkhere 07/14/2017 at 06:58

0

https://www.facebook.com/BPperformance1.8/

AfromanGTO > whatuptkhere 07/14/2017 at 20:20

0

But your land barges handle better than most. Most of the US lightweight rwd cars handled like glorified trucks. lol

whatuptkhere > nerd_racing 07/16/2017 at 20:22

0

Was it a high power build?

I know people do beat up on them but I think budget and reliability are key for me and those don’t align with rotary, you know? Definitely something I want to do one day.

whatuptkhere > nerd_racing 07/16/2017 at 20:22

0

Thanks!

whatuptkhere > pip bip - choose Corrour 07/16/2017 at 20:30

0

Oh it was a joke - Megasquirt :)

nerd_racing > whatuptkhere 07/17/2017 at 07:53

0

It was pretty much stock. Ran great though, even with all of the factory emissions stuff.

whatuptkhere > nerd_racing 07/17/2017 at 20:32

0

Ah yep. I’ve heard a lot of people say that about FBs. It’s always the turbos I hear of that are dying largely thanks to heat, though I’ve heard that you can improve things massively with meth injection.

beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard > whatuptkhere 07/22/2017 at 07:14

0

Barra Mx-5

whatuptkhere > beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard 07/22/2017 at 07:32

0

There’s someone out there with a Jag V-12 up front with ITBs. I feel like God himself should step in and make that car handle, some way, some how...

beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard > whatuptkhere 07/22/2017 at 07:49

0

well. at least it’d sound awesome when you both understeer and oversteer into a tree. All that weight you’d handle like a dart.